newbie with very tough pricing job

Hi all... love this site, I have always wanted to get into line painting but did not know anything about it. I have learned much here and have bought a graco 4 3900 2gun. I have just received notice that my bid for a supply arrangement with local military base was successful( not a big money maker thats for sure but I figure it is a good way to learn. the local rates really suck for some reason... .60 on roads, .80 parking lots per meter Canadian money. I have now been invited to bid on a decommissioned airport project where I must paint 7 Huge X's (each line is 1.8 metres wide and 38.8 meters long.) and two smaller ones where each line is 1.5m wide and 9m long on the taxiway. there are also a few large numbers to black out. I don't have a clue to price this ...product specs tell me 220ft coverage for 6in line...I did the math and it looks like 12 gallons per each large x....for some reason the math does not work with the going rates. I think I need to look at this as metres square rather than lineal meters...the total project calls for 1147 meters square to be painted. I think I could use machine for outline and free spray the rest. I believe I would have to go $6.00 per meter just to cover expenses and make minimal profit. paint is $115.00 Canadian per 5g This math is messing with my head, I don't believe anybody else has been asked for a quote. ANY guidance would be greatly appreciated Hugh Absolute Painting

We were asked to bid some closed runway X's that measured 120'x48' 6' x 129 1/4' (in US Ft.) I ran the numbers and ended up with about $500 an X there were 15 total. I just look at custom work like this, as taking much valuable time, so you better make it worth it if you get it right . Our job was 75 miles away, so I had to account for travel time, accommodations, and material transport to the job. I'm sure many people could do it for less, maybe some can do it for more, It really comes down to what it costs you to do it, and what profit you want to make, or look at it like what profit are you missing from other jobs while you are on this one? Just my two cents...

The first x converts to 1.8 meters = 5.9055118 feet wide and 38.8 meters = 127.2965879 feet long and the smaller converts to 1.5 meters = 4.9212598 feet width and 9 meters = 29.5275591 feet in length. I don't have the time to address this further, maybe someone can help from here, I'll get back to it later.

Absolute painting thats a lot of paint for those crosses! Nice job! I would use your double gun set up with your new machine you've brought, you'll get a good even spray with it. Remember to point the guns together so you don't have a gap between the spray pattern. Your local going rate is .80 cents per lineal meter, if thats for remark thats not a bad price, your grossing .80 cents with each step you take, if you don't loose control of your spending you should yield a good net. Any way with the pricing structure that you have mentioned you would be charging approx $1117.44 for each larger cross times that by 7 would be $7822.08. I can't see this not being worth your while as this job is in one spot. The smaller 2 crosses come to $432.00. I would be careful about blacking out if it's on a runway as black paint tends to be very slippery when wet, unless you put in some some sort of aggregate, but unless the black paint skid resistance specs have been approved by your local roading authority I wouldn't go there, your best bet would be to get the numbers hydroblasted off sub that out and put your mark up on their price.

X's denote closure so no one will be using that area so I don't think you need to bother about the aggregate. However, make sure you check with the right person.

Sounds great .80 is for new paint though. I also think that that the price is too high( would take it if I could get it though) I was thinking 745.00 for each large stripe and 145.00 for each small stripe, I am afraid of losing though. This is so new to me and I was hoping to have more experience before running into weird jobs. The runway is permanently closed as is the airport. I wish I knew how long this job would take, what do you guys think? time and materials? I cant imagine it taking 2 guys more than a four days ... then again I just don't know More Help Please...what is a reasonable amount of time for this? If I had an idea of time then I could make a safe bid. I want the job ... It is my first chance at this government agency. Hugh Absolute Painting

Hugh, I converted all of your measurements to feet to come up with some numbers for you: 1) For each large X, one of the lines will have a total of approximately 1,528 lf. Given the overlap of roughly 6 feet where the lines meet, the second line will be reduced to around 1,456 lf, giving you a total of about 2,984 lf per large X. This would translate into 20,888 lf for all of the large Xs. 2) On the smaller Xs, one line will have approx. 291 lf and the other 245 lf for a total of 536 lf per small X; 1,072 lf total for both. 3) Total linear feet (21,960) divided by the number of lf you get per gallon (220), multiplied by your per-gallon cost ($23) will give you your total estimated paint cost: $2,295. 4) Total paint cost ($2,295) divided by total linear feet (21,960) will give you your per-linear foot paint cost: 10.45 cents. 5) Paint cost per large X is .1045*2,984 = $312.00; paint cost per small x is .1045*536 = $56.00. Keep in mind that these calculations are based on 6" lines. If calculated based on 4" lines, the number of lf would be quite a bit higher (32,944), but based on a 330 lf per gallon estimate for 4" lines, the total paint cost and cost-per X would come out right about the same. As far as the numbers to be blacked out go, if each number were enclosed in a box, what would the dimensions of the box be? Let me know and I can help walk you through the calculations for those. I hope this helps. Remember: It’s a good idea to round numbers up slightly to compensate for any margin of error related to slightly inaccurate measurements, spills, etc You can always use any left over paint on the next job, but coming up short can result in lost time and/or costly return trips. Good luck. Be sure to let us know how everything turns out. Hal

At Cimarron's pricing I would have no problem quoting between $9,000 and $10,000 for the job. If I got the job great and if not fishing season is here. Quoting a price just to get a job doesn't do anyone any good. It just sets a lower price base in your area and no one will ever get ahead. If you do it for a low price just to get your foot in the door then they will expect your future pricing to be in the same general area. Being ready to do the job today will be more important then a lower price in most cases. I have lost a few jobs due to my high pricing only to find that because I did not have a job for that day I was able to do a last minute job for someone else at a much higher price level, and at the higher price level I was able to spend more time on the job thus doing a better job then I could for peanuts.

Dwan's right. Don't undercut the market just to get the job. Basically - you know that the paint will cost right around $2,300. Now you need to figure out all of your additional expenses (travel, gas, materials, labor, etc...). Once you come to that number, decide how much you feel your efforts are worth, based on the time and labor required, and bid accordingly. Talk to your paint rep and see if they will give you a discount for volume, even if it's just for this job. As him/her how much they would knock off of your price if you purchase 100 gallons (which is about what you would need). If we were paying $2,300 for paint on the Xs, our bid on them would fall somewhere in the ballpark of $10,000.

.75 per square foot. Can I sell you the paint for that kind of money. The paint store guy must not be your friend. [email removed]

hi all I am not sure if this will make it to the front of the list or not but...here goes lol Thank you all for your assistance, I found the math mind boggling lol I heard nothing bout the airport job until late fall (about 3 days before snow lol) they then wanted it done. Due to the leaves I upped my price considerably I ended up over estimating the paint by about 8 pails which is OK the job took 2 men three days to totally complete and after paying them and all expenses I made about 3000.00 of the top. I was very nervous going into such a large job with so little experience and knowledge. Fortunately it worked out great and the parking lots are allready coming. Now I need to know how to calculate glass bead and where to get it. thank you so much and I am sorry I did not update you when this job happened. You guys were awesome!!! Hugh Absolute painting

Hugh, Beads are generally applied at 6 lbs per gallon. To calibrate your bead dispenser you will need to do the following. Its a pain in the butt but it's the only way I know how. You will need the following. Two empty one gallon buckets and a bathroom scale. Sit a empty bucket on the scales and place under your bead dispenser. Put the other bucket under your paint gun. Pull the trigger and when the bucket has a gallon in it you should have 6 lbs in the bucket on the scales. It is a pain like I said. I usually just make sure I am putting plenty down without being overly excessive and let it go.

Hugh, I have been told that Airports require a different glass bead that reflects at a different angle.They are more expensive. I don't remember where I found the specs for them as it was a while ago I bid a heliport. I believe I found it on the net searching glass beads. Although the airport is closed i bet F.A.A. would require them. Good luck Milt

Hey Hugh, I would suggest checking with the long liners in your area. I you only require a few bags they can usually help out. They use tonnes over the course of the striping season so they can point you in the right direction. I find that when I need more than a couple of bags I have to pick up myself because the manufacturer considers my order very small. Hop